Consumer Credit Support  
Bailiff Advice Online

Go Back   Consumer Credit Support > Consumer Credit Support > Credit Reference Agencies
FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 08-08-2008, 06:30 PM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

I've been doing lots of checking in between my RBS fight with regards to CRA's because I've got a little fight developing with Callcredit I joined their on line credit site a few weeks back.

I found out that they still hold a default on my file put there by the HBOS,..... now I fought Experian and Equifax over this and they finally gave in and removed it from my file.

Now the same thing is happeneing with Callcredit, things have developed and they say HBOS tell them its correct etc etc and say they cannot remove it and will not remove it, I 've written to their mnaging director a couple of times got short shrift off him so I've stepped up a gear and found things thwt I am sure will help all who are thinking of fighting the CRA's. First .....the Consumer Credit regs and section 159 of the CCA 1974.

When a CRa tells you they cannot remove the data without the suppliers consent .

There is nowhere that says they can't see regs
SCHEDULE 1Regulation 4(1)

CREDIT REFERENCE AGENCY FILES

INDIVIDUALS (INCLUDING SOLE TRADERS)

YOUR RIGHTS UNDER SECTION 159 OF THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974, AND UNDER THE DATA PROTECTION ACT 1998, IF YOU THINK ANY ENTRY IN OUR FILE IS WRONG
This statement of your rights is provided by[<A name=n7><A href="http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2000/20000290.htm#note7">7] together with all the information we hold about you on our files. Our postal address is[<A href="http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2000/20000290.htm#note8">8].

Your rights are as follows -

If you think that any of the information we have sent you is wrong and that you are likely to suffer because it is wrong, you can ask us to correct it or remove it from our file.

You need to write to us telling us what you want us to do. You should explain why you think the information is wrong.

If you write to us, we have to reply in writing within 28 days.

Our reply will tell you whether we have corrected the information, removed it from our file or done nothing. If we tell you that we have corrected the information, you will get a copy.

If our reply says that we have done nothing, or if we fail to reply within 28 days, or if we correct the information but you are not happy with the correction, you can write your own note of correction and ask for it to be included on our file.

To do this, you will need to write to us within 28 days of receiving our reply. If you did not get a reply from us and you want the information we sent you to be corrected, you will need to write to us within 8 weeks of the letter you wrote to us in which you asked us to correct the information or remove it from our file.

Your letter will need to - include the note of correction you have written. It must not be more than 200 words long and should give a clear and accurate explanation of why you think the information is wrong. If the information is factually correct but you think it creates a misleading impression, your note of correction can explain why.
ask us to add your note of correction to our file and to include a copy of it whenever we give anyone any of the information you think is wrong or any information based on it.
If we accept your note of correction, we have to tell you in writing within 28 days that we are going to add it to our file.

If we think it would be wrong to add your note of correction to our file, we have to apply for a ruling from the Data Protection Commissioner.

We will apply for a ruling if we do not want to include your note of correction because we think it is wrong, or because we think it is defamatory, frivolous or scandalous, or unsuitable for publication for some other reason. We can only refuse to include your note of correction if the Commissioner agrees with us.

If we have not written to you within 28 days of receiving your note of correction, or if we have written telling you that we are not going to add your note of correction to our file, you can appeal to the Data Protection Commissioner.

If you want to do this, you will have to write to the following address[<A href="http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2000/20000290.htm#note9">9] -

The Data Protection Commissioner Wycliffe House Water Lane Wilmslow Cheshire SK9 5AF Telephone no. 01625-545700
Fax no. 01625-524510
e.mail: data&commat;wycliffe.demo n.co.uk

When you write, you must give the following details -

your full name and address
our name and address
details of the information you think is wrong, including -
why you think it is wrong, why you think you are likely to suffer because it is wrong, and an indication of when you sent us your note of correction.

It would be helpful to the Commissioner if you could include a copy of your note of correction.

Before deciding what to do, the Commissioner may ask us for our side of the story and send us a copy of your letter. In return, you will be sent any comments we make.

The Commissioner can make any order she thinks fit when she has considered your appeal. For example, she can order us to accept your note of correction and add it to our file.

If at any stage we fail to correct or remove wrong information, you can ask the Data Protection Commissioner to check whether we are meeting the requirements of the Data Protection Act 1998.

The Data Protection Act 1998 requires us to take reasonable steps to check the accuracy of personal information. If you think we have failed to correct or remove wrong information about you, you have the right to ask the Data Protection Commissioner, at the above address, to check whether our dealing with your information has met this requirement.

Important Note: The various time limits referred to in this statement (mostly 28 days) start with the day following receipt and end with the day of delivery. That means (for example) that if you have 28 days to reply to a letter from us, the period starts with the day after you receive our letter; and you then have to make sure that your reply is delivered to us no later than 28 days from that date. In order to avoid the risk of losing your rights you should therefore allow for postal delays.


I wrote this letter to John Mc Andrew (this is the 3rd)
For the Personal attention of
Mr John McAndrew
Managing Director of Callcredit Ltd
One Park Lane
Leeds.
West Yorkshire
LS 1EP

Dear Mr McAndrew,

I write further to you with regard the unlawful default showing on my credit file held by Callcredit.

I have received this e-mail from your customer services, and I refer you to the rest of this letter.

"Hi William This message is being sent further to your recent dispute about a record on your credit file being provided to us by HBOS. HBOS has advised that the record in question is correctly recorded and cannot be removed from your credit file. Should you wish to dispute this matter further, we would request that you contact HBOS directly. We trust that this information is of assistance to you. Kind regards Customer Care"
2008-07-31 14:59:18
3 days to answer

I have requested that you obtain a copy of the fully executed agreement that HBOS must have to lawfully supply the default data to you. I have also made you aware that HBOS will be unable to supply that agreement.

I will therefore make no further comment except I intend to take action via the courts against both Callcredit and HBOS, and merely say I am confident I will be successful in that litigation claim

Both will be co-defendants in this litigation, I have advised the Chairman’s office of the HBOS of the same fact.

CRA’sIt is important to note that by virtue of (a) above it is not enough for a data controller to say that, because the information was obtained from either the data subject or a third party, they had done all that they could reasonably have done to ensure the accuracy of the data at the time. Now data controllers may have to go further and take reasonable steps to ensure the accuracy of the data themselves and mark the data with any objections. The extent to which such steps are necessary will be a matter of fact in each individual case and will depend upon the nature of the data and the consequences of the inaccuracy for the data subject. This approach exceeds the requirements of the Fifth Principle in the 1984 Act.


Any default record should be accurate. We normally expect a lender to keep records that are necessary to showan agreement exists and to support filing a default. We would also expect a lender to be able to produce evidence to justify a default record they had placed on a credit reference file. Not having any supporting records may indicate a breach of the data protection principle requiring personal data to be adequate, relevant and not excessive for the purpose for which it is processed.I

Is the lender prepared to take court action if not why not?

HBOS do not intend and will not take action against me, because they hold no lawful enforceable agreement.

If there is a genuine, reasonable and unresolved dispute between the borrower and lender, then we are likely to find that personal data have been processed unfairly if a default has been filed. Defaults filed in these circumstances may also be inadequate for the purpose of credit referencing in that they do not provide meaningful information about the creditworthiness of the customer.

HBOS by being unable to supply a copy of the fully executed agreement cannot ask the court to enforce it under section 65 of the CCA, they have not applied to do this for reason HBOS are fully aware that any attempt to enforce it would not succeed, section 127 of the CCA would prevent this. I paste here the Law Lords ruling on this issue. Taken from Wilson v First Counties Trust;

Quote;Failure to comply with the duty to supply a copy of an executed or unexecuted agreement pursuant to sections 62 and 63 section 127(4) precludes the court from making an enforcement order
.In effect, the creditor – by failing to ensure that he obtained a document signed by the debtor which contained all the prescribed terms – must (in the light of the provisions in sections 65(1) and 127(3) of the 1974 Act) be taken to have made a voluntary disposition, or gift, of the loan monies to the debtor. The creditor had chosen to part with the monies in circumstances in which it was never entitled to have them repaid.

A default cannot be registered on a “gift”. Yours sincerely sparkie

Then I sent this E -mail this afternoonDear Callcredit,

Under section 159 and consumer Credit Regulations, I can see no regulation tat states that a CRA cannot remove data without the consent of the creditor/supplier of that data. This being so when you tell me that you cannot remove it without the consent of HBOS you are actually making a negligent misrepresetative statement under the misrepresentation Act 1967.

S2(1) Misrepresentation Act 1967
Negligent Misrepresentation
For negligent misrepresentation the burden of proof rests on the representee to show that they had reasonable grounds for believing it to be true. This can be a heavy burden to discharge.

Therefore I again demand that this entry be removed. Yours sincerely sparkie
2008-08-08 15:36:42
Normally they take 2 days to reply to an e-mail enquiry/complaint BUT I got this back 23 minutes later

Dear Mr sparkie Thank you for your message. Your comments have been forwarded to John McAndrew for his attention. Kind Regards Customer Care 2008-08-08 15:59:11

That's pretty quick dont you think ? Wonder if I have made them sit up a bit and take real notice.

sparkie

Last edited by sparkie1723 : 08-08-2008 at 06:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-08-2008, 07:20 PM
BOUDICCA BOUDICCA is offline
Assistant Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,144
BOUDICCA will become famous soon enoughBOUDICCA will become famous soon enough
Default

Good for you sparkie.

I am on the case with Equifax

BOUDICCA
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-08-2008, 09:58 PM
Hocuspocus's Avatar
Hocuspocus Hocuspocus is offline
Assistant Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,253
Hocuspocus has a spectacular aura aboutHocuspocus has a spectacular aura about
Default

My opinion Call credit is the worst of them all, I'm liking your work Sparkie
i may just have to drop him nd email myself.
__________________
I will not be on the internet after the end of January 2009, so will not be around as much as usuall.
Anyone who wants to email me still go ahead but i won't be checking daily, more like weekly up the library.

" the cages we live in are often of our own making"

time for a life style change
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 08-08-2008, 10:25 PM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Did anyone notice the change in the retoric from ..." Hi William" ....to............"Dear Mr sparkie"???
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 09-08-2008, 05:04 PM
Hocuspocus's Avatar
Hocuspocus Hocuspocus is offline
Assistant Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,253
Hocuspocus has a spectacular aura aboutHocuspocus has a spectacular aura about
Default

I thought you put that in there just doing a incognito name change LOL
__________________
I will not be on the internet after the end of January 2009, so will not be around as much as usuall.
Anyone who wants to email me still go ahead but i won't be checking daily, more like weekly up the library.

" the cages we live in are often of our own making"

time for a life style change
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 14-08-2008, 10:04 AM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Just Checked my file with Callcredit and noticed the HBOS default has magically disappeared the same way it magically appeared so I have just sent them this e-mail.
sparkie

I notice that the default on my credit file inserted by HBOS has now been removed. I have received no notification that this had been done
Callcredit have informed me that HBOS would not allow you to remove it and you could not do so.
Please explain why since I informed you that you had made misrepresentative statements to me, and I intended to take action against Callcredit.
Would you also confirm;
1.Did Callcredit that removed it on the instruction of the HBOS or ;
2.Have Callcredit removed it on their own initiative,

I request this information for use in my Particulars of Claim against HBOS and Callcredit.
Should you not answer these questions freely, Callcredit to will be asked them in court in order for the court to proportion the amount of blame to Callcredit and HBOS for this unlawful damaging default ,
Thank you
Yours sincerely
sparkie
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 14-08-2008, 10:20 AM
Hocuspocus's Avatar
Hocuspocus Hocuspocus is offline
Assistant Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,253
Hocuspocus has a spectacular aura aboutHocuspocus has a spectacular aura about
Default

Cheeky xxxxx , Editing your file with no notice, i thought the files belonged to "us" what they doing writing a novel and don't want you to view until they have the finished master piece
__________________
I will not be on the internet after the end of January 2009, so will not be around as much as usuall.
Anyone who wants to email me still go ahead but i won't be checking daily, more like weekly up the library.

" the cages we live in are often of our own making"

time for a life style change
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 14-08-2008, 10:44 AM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hocuspocus View Post
Cheeky xxxxx , Editing your file with no notice, i thought the files belonged to "us" what they doing writing a novel and don't want you to view until they have the finished master piece

Hi HP,
They are writing a new Harry Potter " Harry Potter and the disapearing defaults"

sparkie
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 14-08-2008, 10:02 PM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Just had another answer e-mail from Callcredit because I sent them another one.


Hi William, Thank you for your recent message. You comments will be passed over to John McAndrew in due course. I can confirm that the default has now been removed from your credit file. It does not show on our records. It is likely that this account was removed by HBOS in one of the updates they have sent through to us since your last correspondence. We would be unable to remove the data without the permission of the data provider in this case HBOS and as they did not provide this authorisation before we would have been unable to remove it. ...( Once again how is it that if when they do query an entry with a supplier ...and....if they do not hear from them within 28 days ...they remove that info/data?? They have just said they can't remove it without the suppliers permission ....Negligent false statement....) If HBOS has removed the account at their end this would have filtered through on to our system. I would advise you contact HBOS directly to ensure this is the case. I trust this information is of assistance. Kind Regards, Customer Care2008-08-14 11:28:37

This means that John McAndrew CallCredit managing director has at last found out that HBOS do not have an agreemt under which they can supply info.....something they would have found out if they had complied with the Fourth Principle of the Data Protection Act in the first place BEFORE Callcredit allowed it to put on my file...everyone can bet their bottom dollar its off to court with HBOS and Callcredit

Also what another load of lies ....they have just said that HBOS most likely removed it through one of their updates......I know for a fact the updates take place at the end of every month not in the middle evrey other update was on the 28th of the month....who are they kidding?

sparkie

Last edited by sparkie1723 : 14-08-2008 at 10:07 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 14-08-2008, 10:24 PM
sparkie1723 sparkie1723 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,533
sparkie1723 has a spectacular aura aboutsparkie1723 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Return E-mail to Callcredit in reply to the one received below,

sparkie

Dear Callcredit Customer care team

I copy below your last e-mail ,will you please explain the section I have placed in inverted commas?,
It is fact that when a data subject disputes an entry and Callcredit contact the supplier of that data....when no response is received from that supplier Callcredit remove the entry..........then how can it be said that you cannot remove data without the permission of that supplier?????..That is without any doubt what so ever a provable false misleading statement under the New Fraud Act 2006.
I have put the sections applicable to Callcredit in "inverted commas".

2 Fraud by false representation
(1) A person is in breach of this section if he—
(a) dishonestly makes a false representation, and
(b) intends, by making the representation—
(i) to make a gain for himself or another, or
(ii ........"to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss."... (2)
A representation is false if—
(a) it is untrue or misleading, and
(b) ........"the person making it knows that it is, or might be, untrue or misleading"......
(3) “Representation” means any representation as to fact or law"......, including a representation as to the state of mind of—
(a) the person making the representation, or
(b) any other person.
(4) A representation may be express or implied.
(5) "....."For the purposes of this section a representation may be regarded as made if it (or anything implying it) is submitted in any form to any system or device designed to receive, convey or respond to communications (with or without human intervention)"......


Hi William, Thank you for your recent message. You comments will be passed over to John McAndrew in due course. I can confirm that the default has now been removed from your credit file. It does not show on our records. It is likely that this account was removed by HBOS in one of the updates they have sent through to us since your last correspondence. ....."We would be unable to remove the data without the permission of the data provider in this case HBOS and as they did not provide this authorisation before we would have been unable to remove it". .......If HBOS has removed the account at their end this would have filtered through on to our system. I would advise you contact HBOS directly to ensure this is the case. I trust this information is of assistance. Kind Regards, Customer Care 2008-08-14 11:28:
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Consumer Credit Support